What did you think?

Some times Byrd rambles, but he's good today. Ed's keeping him on his game.

Some times those "long in the tooth" guys (Like Byrd and John Conyers) take a while to get to their point.

Byrd sometimes does ramble a bit but it's worth listening to. I grew up in West Virginia and was honored to be represented by him during the time I lived there.

I tend to worship the old fart!! I thought he did a great job on today's show - yes, Ed kept him on course, which was a huge factor.
What I love most about Byrd is that he has apparently memorized the entire Constitution (of course he's had plenty of time to do it, eh?).
Thanks for having him on the show!
P.S.: I haven't missed a show since it first aired on KTPR-FM here in San Antonio on April 9th. A Red Letter Day!!!

It was great, Holmey. My favorite was when he talked about having a copy of the constitution in his pocket. I think that would be a good idea for all of us-I'm going to try to find one.

I had an idea for a show that I think would be good for all progressives to be exposed to: George Lakoff is a member of the Rockridge Institute and a noted linguist. He has appeared with Bill Moyers and others and has a great take on what the right has accomplished through the use of language. Progressives always talk about "reframing", but until I heard what Mr. Lakoff had to say, I hadn't heard a real convincing better way. His most recent discussions have been about the reframing of the "war on terror" to the struggle "against global extremism". Here's the address of his web site http://www.rockridgeinstitute.org/research/lakoff/gwot_rip
Please check it out. One of the great things I heard him discussing was about the term tax relief, which he points out implies that there was some sort of affliction for which the GOP is going to provide a cure.
PEACE!

I have two in my car.

And here's an online one to "carry" around.

http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html

What a great human being! I'd been thinking about Byrd's book for a while (since Ed quotes it) so I went out and bought Losing America. A very truthful, if sad, read about our great country, and how far it's fallen.

BTW, the Hannity clones ought to realize that Byrd hasn't been a member of the KKK during the past 60 years! Geez, enough with the Klanr eference every time Byrd speaks! Like Ed, he had a change of heart and became a positive force in our country.

He appears to be a pompous buffoon, during his windy filibusters we have learned weighty things like "My little dog Billy makes me laaaaugh!"

Before you think he has changed that much since his klan days 60 years ago read about some more recent observations by him:


Here’s a quote from Senior Democrat Senator Robert Byrd, of West Virginia, in March of 2001:

"My old mom told me, 'Robert, you can't go to heaven if you hate anybody.' We practice that," the senator recalled. "There are white niggers. I've seen a lot of white niggers in my time – I’m going to use that word.”

The media was quick to point out Lott’s past remarks and his MLK vote.

So would it be fair to point out that Byrd was national treasurer of the Ku Klux Klan? Would it be fair to point out that Byrd has never publicly disavowed his association with the Klan?

Would it be fair to quote Byrd in 1944 on the issue of a desegregated miltary? “Rather I should die a thousand times, and see Old Glory trampled in the dirt never to rise again, than to see this beloved land of ours become degraded by race mongrels, a throwback to the blackest specimen from the wilds."

Very eloquent, there, Bob. Allow me to paraphrase. You’d rather die than serve next to a black man.

http://www.timeswrsw.com/V122102.HTM

Sorry Leon, but "race mongrels" is Virginia 'code' for Texas oilmen from the area around Crawford.

Mac

So, a man is steadfast in his opinions after 60+ years, but a SCOTUS candidate is "flexible" despite something he wrote only 20 years ago, where he totally denounced a concept? Would that make Scalito a "flip-flop"?

Get off it. You didn't even listen to the show, and this proves it.

Your just a troll here.

I liked it, but it felt a bit rushed. I guess that can't always be helped though.

Would it be fair to point out your blatent LIE?



Byrd has apologized more times than you can count.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/conte...5061801105.html


Despite his many achievements, however, the venerated Byrd has never been able to fully erase the stain of his association with one of the most reviled hate groups in the nation's history.

"It has emerged throughout my life to haunt and embarrass me and has taught me in a very graphic way what one major mistake can do to one's life, career, and reputation,"

His latest account is consistent with others he has offered over the years that tend to minimize his direct involvement with the Klan and explain it as a youthful indiscretion. "My only explanation for the entire episode is that I was sorely afflicted with tunnel vision -- a jejune and immature outlook -- seeing only what I wanted to see because I thought the Klan could provide an outlet for my talents and ambitions," Byrd wrote.

Byrd said last week that his membership in the Baptist church tempered his views and marked "the beginning of big changes in me." And like other southern and border-state Democrats of his time, Byrd came to realize that he would have to temper his blatantly segregationist views and edge toward his party's mainstream if he wanted to advance on the national stage.

James Tolbert, president of the West Virginia chapter of the NAACP and an occasional critic of the senator, said Byrd transcended his past by gradually embracing more enlightened social views and by simply owning up to his past mistakes. "He doesn't try to lie his way out of things," Tolbert said. "If he's wrong, he'll say he's wrong."

Ken Hechler, 90, a liberal Democratic former U.S. House member from West Virginia who served with Byrd in Congress, "It's impossible for anyone to try to whitewash the KKK and its overall symbolism."

"But at the same time," he added, "we honor those people who publicly admit the error of their ways."

Last week, Byrd said: "I know now I was wrong. Intolerance had no place in America. I apologized a thousand times . . . and I don't mind apologizing over and over again. I can't erase what happened

I hope RB stays for a long time. He keeps it fresh in the minds of conservatives that you can be forgiven for any thing you have done in the past if you have a D after your name and never if you have a R.

Perhaps that's because the voters understand the difference between a misdemeanor and a felony.
And the difference between the humility of begging ones pardon and the hubris of saying "I didn't do anything wrong."

Sincerity is the one thing that can't be faked.


Mac

You know he was a member of the kkk?

It doesnt matter he has a d next to his name he is clearned of all wrong doing and can continue to load pork up for the state of WV

As I am sure you know, the NAACP has supported Byrd for a long time now. Either they have embraced the KKK agenda or Robert Byrd has proven over the years that he has turned over a new leaf. Which do you think it is?

In order to be forgiven you have to admit you were wrong and guilty to begin with. The problem with the neocorporofacists we have in power now is that they won't admit guilt or ever being wrong about anything.

I missed the show, alas, but I would LOVE to see Byrd as president. It will never happen, but he would be 10,000 times better than Bush.

A Byrd in the hand is worth two Bushes.


Paleo Liberal

Ole' Sheets? I love Sheets Bryd!!!
I have him on my ghoul pool list for John & Ken, KFI Los Angeles.
If he kicks, plus my other cool picks... then I can win a prize.
You think he'll get to a point where they'll have to carry him in and out like ole' Strom? God, I hope so, now that's funny. I don't care who you are.

Apparently it took old Bob a little while to get around to memorizing the 15th amendment. I know, I know, you libs are all for forgiving him, claiming its been "60 years" since he had any KKK ties. Calling it a "youthful indiscretion", although he was pushing 30 when he finally renounced the KKK, or a "mistake" as if being a Grand Kleagle in the Klan was the same as bumping into a waiter. 3 years after he "renounced" his ties he wrote a letter to the grand wizard of the KKK telling him that the Klan was needed "more now than ever" and in every state. It was 20 years after that when Byrd and a score of other DEMOCRATS filibustered the civil rights act. As recently as 2001 he was referring to "white niggers" on national TV. "worship the old fart"? wow.

Libs stood by and Kerry participated in the tarring of Judge Pickering as a racist despite Charles Evers, brother of slain civil rights activist Megar Evers, going on show after show defending his good friend Charles Pickering whom he had known most of his life.

The fact that the NAACP would endorse Byrd just goes to show how far they have fallen from a true civil rights organization to a tool of the democrat party.

Oh, be quiet! Nobody said anything about loving him in his KKK days. However, unlike some politicians I know, he has admitted his guilt and asked forgiveness. That approach goes a long way toward making friends and influencing people.
Our president has had a series of "youthful indiscretions," which he has yet to apologize for.
As for his reference to "white niggers" on national TV, I think I missed that, but he was using the word in its original context - thief. Look it up in your Funk & Wagner.
Sallie

So now you're equating the "youthful indiscretions" of a near 30 year old Grand Kleagle of the KKK and a 40+ year old Democrat party leader (how long did old Bob get to be "youthful" anyway?) leading a filibuster of the civil rights act to a college aged person drinking and doing some blow. If that is your rationalization, then by all means worship away, a guy like Byrd should be your god. As to "niggers" being meant as thiefs, yeah I'll bet that's what he meant. Why don't you pull out your Funk And Wagners and look up what he meant when he said on the issue of a desegregated miltary? “Rather I should die a thousand times, and see Old Glory trampled in the dirt never to rise again, than to see this beloved land of ours become degraded by race mongrels, a throwback to the blackest specimen from the wilds." Do tell, Sallie, what does F&W say about "race mongrels" and "throwbacks to the blackest specimen from the wilds"

and no, I won't be quiet

"Oh, be quiet" was a mild rebuke, not a command. And, I admit I made a mistake by calling the specific dictionary "Funk and Wagner." Actually it's "Funk and Wagnall."
So, with that straightened out, Byrd has admitted to the error of his ways. He's sorry for what he said and did and he has publicly asked for forgiveness. No! I'm not recommending that we overlook his past, but I am recommending that we view him in the present tense.
GW Bush, on the other hand, has never once admitted an error, which is why his poll ratings are so low. You can say what you want about Robert Byrd - and you'd probably be correct on all scores. What makes him palatable is his ability to assume blame for his past words and actions, and learn from his mistakes rather than plunging blindly ahead without conscience.
You obviously don't get that, do you?
Sallie

What I "don't get" is you dems moral bankruptcy. You want something recent? There have been a total of 2 black supreme court nominees. Byrd voted no on both (T Marshall & C Thomas), he went for the trifecta voting No for Rice as sec of state. Those reprehensible things he said, however long ago, would never be forgiven of a republican. I offered C Pickering as a case in point. Kerry and the other dems labeled him a racist AND filibustered him when nothing could be further from the truth. Is not the brother of Medgar Evers a good enough character witness for you? If you want someone to admire who is unfairly labeled as a racist, I will take Pickering over Byrd any day. Here is a link if u are interested

http://www.nationalreview.com/york/york020602.shtml

Well, surprise, surprise! I wouldn't have voted for Thomas either. And I'm far from a white supremist. I don't know your age, but I was marching for desegregation more than 40 years ago.
Thurgood Marshall was an excellent Supreme Court Justice and I think you might find that he was nominated well before Byrd had his change of heart. Condoleeza Rice is a joke. She's not even popular in the Black community. A great number of Blacks don't even consider her "Black" because of her cossetted upbringing.
So, of the three nominations that Byrd opposed, I would have opposed two. Hmmmmm..... Makes me a bigot? I don't think so..... Sallie

And of your party's disgraceful treatment of Judge Pickering, you have no comment? Rather than a change of heart Mr. Pickering spent his life fighting the Klan, sending his own children to de-segregated public schools when he could have easily afforded private, and doing far more than marching. Yet your parties presidential nominee, when he wasn't shamelessly photo-opping in black churches (which he had NEVER attended before in his life) with the likes of Al Sharpton, calls him a racist? You are the party of racists and always have been. The fact that you would so easily forgive Byrd while villifying Pickering because Byrd is a democrat is more than adequate proof.

RE Rice not being "black", that is another tactic of your racist party. You call even black people "racist" (see precilla owen, daughter of sharecroppers et al) when they don't subscribe to whatever leftist agenda that you may espouse.

because it not really about race, it doesn't matter what color a person is if they are against liberal Ideals then it is ok to use what ever is needed to make sure that person is minimized. Whatever it takes. Liberal can not allow minorities to speak out against the Dem party it is the only reason they have a chance to win any national election. Why do you think they want illegals to vote why do you think they run commericals on spanish television? If you must speak and understand English to become a citizen. why would they push for biligual ballot and pay people to register them to vote?

EXACTLY, Mac -- You hit the nail on the head!

Mr Byrds "change of heart" seems to come later and later in his life. When he first "renounced" the Klan he was near 30 in the 1940's. When he was filibustering the civil rights bill in '64 he was he was in his 40's. I believe T Marshall was nominated in 1968? That would put Byrd near 50 (at least 45+). When did he have his change of heart again? When you are approaching 50 do you still get the "youthful indiscretion" pass if you are a dem? RE my previous post I meant J Rogers Brown, not Precilla Owens, I mistakenly identified which of the many qualified judges you were senselessly filibustering, but I would prefer you to address your party's shameful treatment of Pickering. Or if you prefer, perhaps you could expound on how the eminently qualified C Rice is a "joke"? Just for fun perhaps you could compare and contrast the qualifications and accomplishments of Ms. Rice vs those of Madeline "not so" Albright?

What exactly is YOUR POINT, "Tom Paine"? Are you advocating that we disregard Byrd's political career and his wisdom on the Constitution because he had racist tendencies early on? Is THAT your point? Or are you just working to get a rise out of some lefties because you hate us so much? You have called us "morally bankrupt" and "racist" --- for WHAT? For admiring a man who, admittedly behaved badly, who has asked for and been granted forgiveness for that behavior, and who has a world of wisdom on some very important issues? Your heroes have been behaving badly for years RECENTLY, causing needless American deaths and breaking the laws of this land right and left, while LYING about it, ALL WITHOUT EVER ADMITTING ANY WRONGS OR ASKING FORGIVENESS. Why don't you go work on that, instead of coming here and insulting the good people on this board...

As for the Pickering case, I wasn't that aware of all that went on with it. If he was unfairly criticized, then that was wrong. But your tit-for-tat condemnation of a good man because of what happened to another good man, is petty and offensive.

Oh, and by the way, I find your choice of the member name, Tom Paine, interesting. Thomas Paine was a great patriot who would have loathed the Bush administration and what they are doing to this country. Is he one of your heroes?

This just proves the conservatives only forgive Republicans. Byrd was a member for a short while in his twenties, and the idiots still call him "Sheets".

But GW Bush can be a cokehead in his forties, and all is forgiven, even though one is not a crime even today, and the other is a felony that would get you stiff prison time.

Pure, rank hypocrisy.

GoU

You should try to retire early tonight, so you can stay awake during the service tomorrow. You might learn something about Jesus' teachings. . .

I dont think that he is of the same mind set today that he was when young. Age has a wonderful way of opening your eyes to what is important. I believe that he regrets deeply his involement and not just because it looks bad now, but because he has seen the error of racist thinking. Too bad it doesnt happened to all who think that the amount of melon sp has anything to do with anything in todays world. That being said I really dont see a connection with the coke thing at all.

It's about guilt and forgiveness, mr. pop. Although he turned on it years ago, the right refuses to forgive and forget.

But GW Bush committed FELONIES here in America, cocaine use is a felony. It's well-known he did it, and he's never denied it, and many from the right say he's admitted it privately. He's also admitted he's an alcoholic.

So, does the right say a word? Of course not! He's forgiven!

It's all about whether there's a D or an R after your name. You, for instance, Mr. pop. You defend the right, and all their crimes. You don't call Bush a cokehead.

Yet you constantly harp on Conyers "using tax money to babysit his kids". You've done it often on this board. Is there any proof? Of course not! But since it's against a democrat, that's all you need.

What a hypocrite.

GoU

If anybody cares, the History Channel is showing a program about Thomas Paine right now! Isn't that amazing?

There is hyprorisy allright, and it is coming from the Democrats. You all want to forgive the likes of Byrd and G Wallace (you may rememember "Segregation today, segregation tommorrow, segregation forever!!!!) because they are democrats. But Strom Thurman and Jesse Helms are racist for life apparently. Strom reconciled with his African American daughter and she believes in his conversion and said so on 60 minutes. More importantly, as I have said many times in this thread and no one is willing to address it, is the democrats shameful branding as a racist of a man (Charles Pickering) who fought the KKK for years and was supported by lifelong friend and brother of slain civil rights activist Medgar Evers. Your presidential candidate John Kerry slandered him as a racist while campaigning in black churches, which he had not entered his entire life previously.

As to Byrd "in his 20's", well he was in his late 20's when he renounced the KKK, but then 3 years letter wrote a letter to the Grand Wizard of the Klan saying how they were needed now more than ever and in every state. In the same letter Byrd offered to help. Byrd was past 40 when he, along with a score of other senators (democrats all) filibustered the civil rights act of 1964. He was closer to 50 than he was to 40 when he voted against his own parties SC nominee and first black SC nominee, Thurgood Marshall, so don't tell me this nonsense about a "short while in his 20's".

[But your tit-for-tat condemnation of a good man because of what happened to another good man, is petty and offensive.

Oh, and by the way, I find your choice of the member name, Tom Paine, interesting. Thomas Paine was a great patriot who would have loathed the Bush administration and what they are doing to this country. Is he one of your heroes?

[/quote]

First off, to refer to Pickering and Byrd as "good men" as if they are the same is prepostorous. One fought racism and the Klan all his life and still was branded a racist by the likes of John Kerry. One was testifying against KKK Grand Wizard Sam Bowers in the fire bombing murder of civil rights worker Vernon Dahmer the very same year that the other was voting against his own parties first ever African American SC nominee. One sent his children to integrated public schools while it was uncommon for anyone in the south let alone the law of the land, the other filibustered the civil rights act of 1964. One was a grand Kleagle in the Klan during the time when they were doing more than marching around in sheets, they were murdering, lynching, and terrorizing African Americans. The other is fully endorsed by the brother of slain civil rights activist Medgar Evers, Charles Evers. I didn't bring up the comparison as a "tit for tat", but rather to express my disgust of some on this board to express admiration (or in her own words "worship") of Byrd while her party villifies true civil rights heroes like Pickering. If there is anything that you should find "petty" and "offensive" it is the treatment by your party of people like Charles Pickering and Janice Rogers Brown.

http://www.nationalreview.com/murdock/murd...00311140920.asp

As for my selection of T Paine as a screen name, I did it on purpose, as I know you liberals love to claim him as one of your own but have absolutely no understanding of the man or what he believed in. The other founding fathers are too "preachy and religious" for lib tastes. Libs had a hissy fit when Reagan quoted him in his acceptance speech in 1980

http://65.126.3.86/reagan/html/reagan07_17_80.shtml

(you should read it, it is a moving and compelling speech)

About the only thing Thomas Paine has in common with modern liberalism was his aversion to organized religion. I suspect you are wrong about what Paine might think of the current administration. He was a believer in freedom for all, and that means in the world.

"Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of defending it" -Thomas Paine

"The world is my country, all mankind are my bretheren, and to do good my religion" - Thomas Paine

"We fight not to enslave, but to set a country free, and to make room upon the earth for honest men to live" - Thomas Paine

"Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil, in its worst state, an intolerable one" - Thomas Paine


Sounds like Reagan to me

Proof How many of his workers have to come forward to complain? A charge of corruption has been brought and yet you dont want it investagated unless it has to do with a rep. Investagate them all what are you afraid of?

Let's try on a few facts for size here. Number 1--no investigation of Mr. Conyers has proceeded in the House ethics committee because of insufficient votes to convene one. Number 2 no federal grand jury has been formed because the U.S. Attorney with jurisdiction has not asked for one because of insufficient evidence to date. Note that this could change if the US Atty gains additional evidence.

The Democratic caucus has removed Mr. Jefferson from the Ways and Means committee and has sent forth a resolution for expulsion under the House rules even though Mr. Jefferson has not been indicted or convicted of anything. They looked at the evidence and have chosen to act on it today.

The Republican caucus did NOTHING about Duke Cunningham until his conviction was recorded--no ethics investigation, no internal investigation, no removal from any committees, no restrictions on his continued involvement in any political or House activities---NOTHING. Does having a price list for bribes to be payed on your official House of Representatives stationary mean anything to the Repubs?? Their actions would say no. Tom DeLay was indicted and only after a major fight were the original rules passed by the Repubs only revised to force him to step down. He has not had his day in court on the one set of charges filed to date, however, his fraudulent filing with the Clerk of the House on his Jack Abramoff Scotland golf trip was an expulsion offense. Did the Republican caucus even investigate his filing, consider the testimony in Federal Court of multiple witnesses about the true cost of the trip, or in any manner shape or form consider that Mr. Delay might have violated the rules???

The Democrats are also investigating Mr. Mollohan about some of his earmarks which may have been improper. Identify one investigation of anyone on the Republican side in the last 12 years (since the 1994 takeover of Congress)---p.s. do not waste your time there are none.

Sorry-- need to correct a mistake--Jefferson has been indicted just got in a hurry and did not type accurately.